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    British Voice Pack - the plan...

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    33lima
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    British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:43 am

    To accompany Phase 1 of STA-Britpak, we need British-accented voices. What I'm using now, is the US voices - at least, that is what I hear, when playing British vehicles. I didn't do anything to get this, it just happened, so whatever association needed to be made, someone had already done it!

    At the risk of upsetting the Canucks (or Yanks!) amongst us, the US voices might do as Canadians - who used British kit in NW Europe, 1944 (and who, along with Polish units, are a logical expansion of Britpak, at some point). But even as Canadians, the US voices we have now are not ideal - there are some issues, like hearing 'On the way!' (a modern US Army gunner's call, the British equivalent being 'Firing now!) when the loader is reporting a round loaded (the modern US call for this is 'AP/HE etc up!', not 'On the way!').

    So we need British-accented voices. We could use the ones I recorded for Panzer Elite, but I think I can do better, and besides, some will need changed, mainly to handle SF's not very satisfactory (Soviet-style, I think) system of using compass bearings for target indications.

    So the plan is to record a complete set of crew voices, the files that go in the folder data/sounds/speech/tank_[nationality], to represent intercom traffic.

    These will use British practice as far as possible. My 'improved' subtitles file - already part of the current Phase 1 download - will be updated to be the same.

    The main change will be to introduce a target indication system which needs to keep the SF compass bearing system, but at the same time, will use something as close as reasonably practicable to British tank commander practice.

    In real life, a fire order might have been like this:

    Gunner [or 'Seventy-five' or 'Co-ax'], traverse left...steady [when the gun is nearly on line with the target]...ON! [when the gun is on line]. Five hundred [range in yards] - tank [target type]...FIRE!'

    In BVP, this has to use the current compass system, so it will be like this:

    Gunner, traverse to zero-six-zero...five hundred...tank...FIRE!!'

    Obviously I can't time this so that 'FIRE!' is shouted when the gunner has, or should have, the target in sight, but it's near enough. And it's close enough to standard SF practice not to sound too unfamiliar to regular players.

    You will, though, have to get used to some British Army terms for target types, like 'SP' for any kind of self-propelled gun, and 'MT' [motor transport] or 'transport' for soft-skinned vehicles. I'm not going to use 'hornet' for 'tank' although that's the term used in Ken Tout's book 'Tank!'.

    Also the command to load will be changed. SF is a bit odd here (Soviet style again I think) because the gunner is actually giving the loader orders, whereas in Western practice the tank commander does this. Anyway, instead of 'Load HE!' or 'Load AP!', you will hear and see 'Action - HE' or 'Action - AP!' and so on.

    I have mentioned only crew voices, because I think I will not bother with infantry ones. They are very atmospheric, but the simple fact is that with headphones over your ears and a large motor at least idling just behind you, you should not be able to hear the typical SF 'battlefield chatter', unless they either used a tank telephone or climbed up on your tank, to talk to you...after you had taken off your virtual headphones. I think this was the sort of thing Frinik had in mind, with his sound mod.

    So, I have three questions, for anyone who can answer them:

    1. How do you stop the use of speech you don't want to hear? Delete the files? Or must you repalce them with silent .wav files?

    2. Is there a recommended or required format for sounds? I recall Panzer Elite's used a set one, which I used Goldwave to record.

    3. How to I set things up, so that when playing with British vehicles (tagged 'gbr', so maybe that's got something to do with it) you will hear the British tank crew voices (which I will presumably place in the folder data/sounds/speech/tank_gbr)?

    Still a long way to go with this, to get a respectable minimum of content, but I'm getting there, SPs or no SPs...

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    lockie
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by lockie on Wed Feb 03, 2016 9:56 am

    Add a new speech is an easy deal.

    1. Make a copy of the next file:
    data\k42\loc_rus\levels\levels\common\snd_list_usa.engcfg
    and rename it on:
    snd_list_gbr.engcfg

    2. Open snd_list_gbr.engcfg and make the next changes:

    main()
    {
    //name, sound
    //{ Load armour piercing round!; }
    load_ap, uload_ap*, txt_sub_load_ap;
    load_sc, uload_sc*, txt_sub_load_sc;
    load_hc, uload_hc*, txt_sub_load_hc;
    ...
    }
    on
    main()
    {
    //name, sound
    //{ Load armour piercing round!; }
    load_ap, bload_ap*, txt_sub_load_ap;
    load_sc, bload_sc*, txt_sub_load_sc;
    load_hc, bload_hc*, txt_sub_load_hc;
    ...
    }
    where,
    "g"- GER
    "u" - USA
    "j" - JAP
    "b" - GBR
    "*" - does u may place many phrases with a different ending

    3. In case, u want the new subtitles, u've to change the text variable, i.e.
    txt_sub_load_ap
    on
    txt_bsub_load_ap
    then add the new enties in the file: loc_kit_subs.text
    txt_bsub_load_ap() { BRITISH AP shell loaded, up!; }
    or any other "gubbins" Smile

    4. Record phrases and name them as noted in the file: snd_list_gbr.engcfg. Sound format:
    ***.wav, PCM, 44100Hz, 1 channel(mono), 16 bits per sample

    5. Replace in all British cfg tanks the next entry:
    //commands list
    snd_list = levels\levels\common\snd_list_usa.engcfg;
    on
    snd_list = levels\levels\common\snd_list_gbr.engcfg;
    That's all.


    Last edited by lockie on Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:38 pm; edited 2 times in total

    Retrofly

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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by Retrofly on Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:50 pm

    I may be able to record some British voices. I can try and get some samples to you, let me know what you need.

    Luke
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    33lima
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:18 pm

    Thanks Luke, that would be helpful.

    At the moment, all I know about file formats is what I can see on the Properties tabs of the files we have now - .wav files witha  bit rate of 705 Kbps, and a file size of typically 60-150kb.

    We need two distinctive voices, at least - an officer voice, as the tank commander, and one or more Other Ranks voice(s), to repressent the driver, co-driver, loader/operator and gunner (in British tanks, the radio op was turret crew, not the bow gunner as in US and German tanks).

    Below is the file with the tank crew subtitles, now updated with more British-style chatter. I have no AFV training, 'foot' infantry only - the only tanks I have ever been in were two ex-Belgian Army M47s, gutted and awaiting towing out as hard targets on the ranges at Otterburn. But these are as seen in several first person sources which show intercom traffic, of which I think John Foley's 'Mailed Fist' is best, for NW Europe 1944-45. The voices samples needed are in the RH column, with the square brackets afterwards being the crewman speaking (where no entry, speaker=tank commander). The 'curly brackets' are what the subtitle shows, on screen.


    oc_rus()
    {

    txt_sub_load_ap() { Action, AP!; }           Action, AP!  
    txt_sub_load_sc() { Action,  HVAP!; }      Action, sabot!
    txt_sub_load_hc() { Action,  HEAT!; }      Action, HEAT!
    txt_sub_load_he() { Action,  HE!; }         Action, HE!
    txt_sub_load_sh() { Load shrapnel!; } -            n/a
    txt_sub_load_kr() { Load practice round!; }      n/a
    txt_sub_ready_ap() { AP loaded!; }          Loaded! [by loader]
    txt_sub_ready_sc() { HVAP loaded!; }        .. .. ..     .. .. .. ..
    txt_sub_ready_hc() { HEAT loaded!; }        .. .. ..     .. .. .. ..
    txt_sub_ready_he() { HE loaded!; }            .. .. ..     .. .. .. ..
    txt_sub_ready_sh() { Shrapnel loaded!; }                n/a
    txt_sub_ready_kr() { Practice round loaded!; }         n/a
    txt_sub_no_load() { Cease loading!; }          Cease loading!
    txt_sub_shot() { Fire!; } Fire!
    txt_sub_short_stop() { Driver, short halt!; }     Driver, short halt!
    txt_sub_dir_forward() { Driver, advance!; }      Driver, advance!
    txt_sub_move_forward() { Driver, advance!; }  Driver, advance!
    txt_sub_move_faster() { Driver, speed up!; }    Driver, speed up!
    txt_sub_move_backward() { Driver, reverse!; } Driver, reverse!
    txt_sub_move_slower() { Driver, slow down!; } Driver, slow down!
    txt_sub_move_leftm() { Driver, left!; }            Driver, left!
    txt_sub_move_lefts() { Driver, turn left!; }      Driver, turn left!
    txt_sub_move_rightm() { Driver, right!; }        Driver, right!
    txt_sub_move_rights() { Driver, turn right!; }   Driver, turn right!
    txt_sub_move_stop() { Driver, halt!; }            Driver, halt!
    txt_sub_move_defence() { Driver, find cover!; }Driver, find cover!
    txt_sub_corr_near() { Over!; }                       Over!
    txt_sub_corr_far() { Short!; }                        Short!
    txt_sub_corr_ok() { Hit!; }                            Hit!
    txt_sub_weapsel_all() { Action, all weapons!; } Action -all weapons!
    txt_sub_weapsel_gun() { Action, main gun; }   Action -main gun!
    txt_sub_weapsel_mgun() { Action, co-ax! }     Action - co-ax!
    txt_sub_trg_inf() { Troops; }                        Troops!
    txt_sub_trg_unk() { Enemy!; }                      Enemy!
    txt_sub_trg_tank() { Tank!; }                       Tank!
    txt_sub_trg_gun() { Target - Gun!; }             Gun!
    txt_sub_trg_mort() { Mortar!; }                    Mortar!
    txt_sub_trg_spg() { SP; }                            SP!
    txt_sub_trg_mgun() { MG! ; }                      MG!
    txt_sub_trg_car() { Transport!; }                 Transport!
    txt_sub_trg_acar() { Light armour!; }            Light armour!
    txt_sub_trg_apc() { Light armour!; }             Light armour!
    txt_sub_dist_50() { Range - 50; }                Fifty!
    txt_sub_dist_100() { Range - 100; }             One hundred! etc
    txt_sub_dist_200() { Range - 200; }
    txt_sub_dist_300() { Range - 300; }
    txt_sub_dist_400() { Range - 400; }
    txt_sub_dist_500() { Range - 500; }
    txt_sub_dist_600() { Range - 600; }
    txt_sub_dist_700() { Range - 700; }
    txt_sub_dist_800() { Range - 800; }
    txt_sub_dist_900() { Range - 900; }
    txt_sub_dist_1000() { Range - 1000; }
    txt_sub_dist_m1000() { Range - over 1000; }
    txt_sub_azim_0() { Bearing - 360; }             Gunner, traverse to three six zero etc
    txt_sub_azim_15() { Bearing - 15; }
    txt_sub_azim_30() { Bearing - 30; }
    txt_sub_azim_45() { Bearing - 45; }
    txt_sub_azim_60() { Bearing - 60; }
    txt_sub_azim_75() { Bearing - 75; }
    txt_sub_azim_90() { Bearing - 90; }
    txt_sub_azim_105() { Bearing - 105; }
    txt_sub_azim_120() { Bearing - 120; }
    txt_sub_azim_135() { Bearing - 135; }
    txt_sub_azim_150() { Bearing - 150; }
    txt_sub_azim_165() { Bearing - 165; }
    txt_sub_azim_180() { Bearing - 180; }
    txt_sub_azim_195() { Bearing - 195; }
    txt_sub_azim_210() { Bearing - 210; }
    txt_sub_azim_225() { Bearing - 225; }
    txt_sub_azim_240() { Bearing - 240; }
    txt_sub_azim_255() { Bearing - 255; }
    txt_sub_azim_270() { Bearing - 270; }
    txt_sub_azim_285() { Bearing - 285; }
    txt_sub_azim_300() { Bearing - 300; }
    txt_sub_azim_315() { Bearing - 315; }
    txt_sub_azim_330() { Bearing - 330; }
    txt_sub_azim_345() { Bearing - 345; }
    txt_sub_dam_fire() { We're on fire! BAIL OUT!; }          We're on fire! BAIL OUT!
    txt_sub_dam_engine() { Sir, engine's damaged!; }        Sir, engine's damaged! [by driver]
    txt_sub_dam_lcat() { Left track damaged, sir!; }          Left track damaged, sir! [by driver]
    txt_sub_dam_rcat() { Right track damaged, sir!; }        Right track damaged, sir! [by driver]
    txt_sub_dam_gun() { Sir, main gun's out of action!; }    Sir, main gun's out of action! [by gunner]
    txt_sub_dam_hit() {  . }                                                     n/a
    txt_sub_dam_drwound() { Driver's wounded, sir!; }        Driver's wounded, sir! [by co-driver]
    txt_sub_dam_gnwound() { Sir, gunner's been hit!; }       Sir, gunner's been hit! [by loader]
    txt_sub_dam_cmwound() { Crikey, the commander's caught one!; } Crikey, the commander's caught one! [by loader]
    txt_sub_dam_ldwound() { Sir, loader's injured!; }            Sir, loader's injured! [by gunner]
    txt_sub_dam_rdwound() { Co-driver's a casualty, sir!; }   Co-driver's a casualty, sir! [by driver]
    txt_sub_dam_drdead() { Driver's had it, sir!; }                Driver's had it, sir! [by co-driver]
    txt_sub_dam_gndead() { Sir, gunner's done for!; }          Sir, gunner's done for! [by loader]
    txt_sub_dam_cmdead() { Bloody hell, the commander's dead!; } Bloody hell, the commander's dead! [by loader]
    txt_sub_dam_lddead() { Loader's been killed, sir!; }          Loader's been killed, sir! [by gunner]
    txt_sub_dam_rddead() { Sir, co-driver's a goner!; }          Sir, co-driver's a goner! [by driver]
    txt_sub_pil_rep_beg() { Debus!; }                                 Debus!
    txt_sub_pil_rep_end() { Mount up!; }                             Mount up!

    Let me know what you fancy tackling. For the tank commander, obviously we want 'best Sandhurst' (spent about 2 weeks there on the TAVR course, back in '76), with a touch of urgency, for the crew we want 'bloke in the street', in terms of acccent/characterisation.

    Ivor


    Last edited by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:37 pm; edited 2 times in total
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    33lima
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:27 pm

    lockie wrote:Add a new speech is an easy deal.

    Thanks Lockie, very helpful as always!
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by lockie on Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:43 pm

    33lima wrote:Thanks Lockie, very helpful as always!
    U're welcome!

    A couple notes:
    U can't place such entry. It is error, coz u missed brackets for the notes.
    txt_sub_load_ap() { Action, AP!; }           Action, AP!  

    U've to change it on the next:
    txt_sub_load_ap() { Action, AP!; }// Action, AP!  

    Sound format:
    ***.wav, PCM, 44100Hz, 1 channel(mono), 16 bits per sample

    U may use many phrases (ie with a differ accent) for the same action.
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    33lima
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:53 pm

    OK thanks. I just cut and pasted the comment to the end, in a Wordpad file I made for easy reference, to make it clearer what the voice would say, and who would say it. I didn't intend to put it into the actual game file itself.

    That sound format sounds familiar - think it's the same as Panzer Elite used.

    Different recordings for the same text would have been useful in Panzer Elite (never tried it there), because that game simulated radio traffic between tanks (one of the biggest gaps in SF, though you tried to do something about this in SD mission 8!) and a sighting or damage report could have come from different tanks. In SF, for tank crew voices anyway, it will always be the same person for the same bit of speech. Where different voices might be useful, is is we have a different voice or accent for each crewmember - the driver could be a Liverpudial, the co-driver from Glasgow, the loader a Geordie etc....provided the accents are not so 'thick' that players have to read the subtitles every time!

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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by Txema on Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:06 pm

    33lima wrote:
    Different recordings for the same text would have been useful in Panzer Elite (never tried it there), because that game simulated radio traffic between tanks (one of the biggest gaps in SF, though you tried to do something about this in SD mission 8!) and a sighting or damage report could have come from different tanks. In SF, for tank crew voices anyway, it will always be the same person for the same bit of speech. Where different voices might be useful, is is we have a different voice or accent for each crewmember - the driver could be a Liverpudial, the co-driver from Glasgow, the loader a Geordie etc....provided the accents are not so 'thick' that players have to read the subtitles every time!

    Hi 33Lima !

    Lockie is referring to the fact that you can have different recordings of the same text by the same person to make the crew sound less "robotic". For example when you have:

    load_ap, bload_ap*, txt_sub_load_ap;

    it means that you can have several sounds named:

    bload_ap1.wav
    bload_ap2.wav
    bload_ap3.wav
    ....................

    and they will be picked randomly each time. All these sounds correspond to the tank commander ordering to load an AP round, but you can have several recordings from the same person to add variety and avoid the "robotic" feeling of hearing exactly the same wav file again and again... I think it really adds to the immersion in the game !!

    Txema
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:32 pm

    Thanks Txema, understood. I'll be happy if we get a full set of single-.wav recordings!

    These commands being spoken according to a drill, you do want them to sound much the same each time, as well as being spoken by the same person. A few may suit different versions - I think the target type 'Panzer' in stock SF's German crew voice set is spoken either as 'Panzer', or as 'Achtung, panzer'! which latter sounds a bit more urgent (tho such variation is not what he would have been taught in Panzerschule!). I suppose a different inflection would help.

    Alternative versions of the casualty reports, is where this facility would be really useful, because they are not being spoken as a drill....although I do not recall ever hearing or seeing them. Damage reports yes, I recall seeing these. But as for casualties, I remember noticing more than once that a crewman was not functioning any more after a hit, without having seen or heard any casualty report (SABOW lets you check).

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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by Retrofly on Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:36 pm

    33lima wrote:

    Let me know what you fancy tackling. For the tank commander, obviously we want 'best Sandhurst' (spent about 2 weeks there on the TAVR course, back in '76), with a touch of urgency, for the crew we want 'bloke in the street', in terms of acccent/characterisation.

    Ivor

    Already brushing up a posh 1940's Britsh accent.

    I was just listening to some pilot chatter from WW2 (I guess similar stature) and they sound just like the 1940's BBC news readers Very Happy

    Also working on my best 1940's cockney guvnor. I'll see how my microphones doing and see if I can get you some samples.
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 5:55 pm

    Retrofly wrote:
    33lima wrote:

    Let me know what you fancy tackling. For the tank commander, obviously we want 'best Sandhurst' (spent about 2 weeks there on the TAVR course, back in '76), with a touch of urgency, for the crew we want 'bloke in the street', in terms of acccent/characterisation.

    Ivor

    Already brushing up a posh 1940's Britsh accent.

    I was just listening to some pilot chatter from WW2 (I guess similar stature) and they sound just like the 1940's BBC news readers Very Happy

    Also working on my best 1940's cockney guvnor. I'll see how my microphones doing and see if I can get you some samples.

    Yeah, 1940s BBC sounds spot on for the troop leader, anything up to 1960s is probably in the same mould, 'Standard British Southern', 'Watch with Mother' and all that!

    Dunno if it makes much difference, but may be worth bearing in mind the way the seaprate target indication files need to fit together - the one that begins 'Gunner, traverse', then the range, then the target type. Bearings should be spoken as written above eg 60 degrees is 'Zero-six-zero' and ranges are just the number, withour 'yards', spoken as 'Three hundred!', 'Seven hundred!' etc. The difference in the way the two types of mumbers are expressed, as well as the sequence, helps make it clear what's a bearing and what's a range, without needing to drag out the command with the descriptors 'bearing' or 'yards'. You know that a bearing comes first and is expressed in THIS way, and a range comes next and is expressed in THAT way.

    The infantry memonic for giving the grunt equivalent (Fire Control Orders) is CLAP - 'Clearly, Loudly, As an order, and with Pauses', which probably suits the tank commander calls, too. I don't think we need to worry about fancy effects like background hiss or pressel switch clicks, audibilty and authenticity is more important than fancy effects, which can easily be over-done.

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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by Retrofly on Wed Feb 03, 2016 6:39 pm

    Thanks for the additional info, I'm "borrowing" a mic from work which seems to be good quality and I'll be doing the recordings in a shed at the end for my garden, nice and quiet.

    Hopefully should have something this evening.
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by lockie on Wed Feb 03, 2016 6:54 pm

    Don't forget to make loudness speech a bit stronger. At least 1.5-2 times(3dB).
    Here's before, loudnes ~18dB


    Here's after, loudness ~11db, density/spectrum is more bigger.
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:49 pm

    I don't know what Retrofly has, Lockie but Goldwave (apart from a demo, which may be what I used for the Panzer Elite BVP) is payware, so this time around I used Audacity for the Schulze's Dairy voice segments. What you are illustrating above in Sony Sound Forge looks like the 'Amplify' function in Audacity:

    file:///C:/Program%20Files%20%28x86%29/Audacity/help/manual/man/amplify.html

    ...does that look right?
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by lockie on Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:18 pm

    link is invalid. I can see nothing. But u've to take the sound at er taste. Does it suit to the common request? If so, then no need to be worried abt. loudness.

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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by Retrofly on Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:14 pm

    So I've done a few recording, check your email 33lima Smile

    I've done most of them but a bit confused with ranges and bearings.

    Can you state what needs to be said for each one of the 2.

    E.G
    txt_sub_dist_100() { Range - 100; }  = "One Hundred"

    txt_sub_azim_0() { Bearing - 360; } = "Three Six Zero" or "Gunner, traverse to three six zero"

    I havn't adjusted any of the levels, unfortunatly some are quiter than others, when I started the level was too high and started clipping so I reduced it down, so they'll need to equalised and then boosted.

    Feel free to reject them, I understand if they ran't what you're looking for etc.

    if you do want to use them let me know if you want me to change or redo any of them. Hopefually get the ranges done at some point too.

    Cheers
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    33lima
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:52 pm

    They sound great! Just what's needed.

    About ranges, we just want the number - eg 'One Hundred!'. Not 'One hundred yards' or 'Range, one hundred!'

    For bearings, similar, except as you have indicated above, the number is spoken as a set of three seperate figures eg 'bearing 360' (= straight ahead) is to be spoken as 'Three-six-zero!'.  The difference here is that we want to add a bit before this bearing, because it comes at the start of the fire order and we want to make it sound authentic.

    So all the bearings are spoken as;

    'Gunner, traverse to one-six-zero! [or whatver the bearing is]

    Generally, tank commander orders need to start with a word which makes it clear at the very beginning to whom the order is directed. 'Driver, advance!' is an obvious example. He doesn't need to say, 'Loader, load AP [or 'Action, AP!', =load AP and keep loading AP, till I tell you otherwise], because it's obviously a loading command, addressed to the loader. In the case of Fire Orders, the command is to the gunner and for our purposes, begins with 'Gunner' (IRL 'Six pounder' or 'Seventy-five' are quoted as being used, which again, are obviously addressed to the gunner, but we can't use them as we will have vehicles with different main guns and need 'one size fits all').

    Retrofly

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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by Retrofly on Wed Feb 03, 2016 11:04 pm

    Ok I understand.

    I'll see if I can make the bearing readings sound more natual for the end of the sentence.
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    Pointer

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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by Pointer on Thu Feb 04, 2016 4:04 am

    What do you think about following convention:

    345, 0, 15 ===> North
    30, 45, 60 ===> North-East
    75, 90, 105 ===>East
    120, 135, 150 ===>South-East
    165, 180, 195 ===>South
    210, 225, 240 ===>South-West
    255, 270, 285 ===>West
    300, 315, 330 ===>North-West

    A bit less precise (8 directions instead of 24), but resulting with very condensed communicates, like:

    North-East / five hundred / tank !

    And nobody will have doubts,  whether it means geographic directions or whether relative to the tank hull (what has been discussed several times on this forum).

    Aso consider, that in SF these communicates seem to be not the commander's orders, but spotting reports of all crew members (you can get several during a short period of time and up to you is to make a decision which target is the first to destroy).
    Orders are only for the driver and for the loader.
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    33lima
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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

    Post by 33lima on Thu Feb 04, 2016 9:15 pm

    Interesting discussion, Pointer!

    To take the second point first, I wondered what the SF convention was, whether these were merely spotting reports from any crew member, or Fire Orders from the tank commander (including the tank commander talking to himself, when you are playing the role!)

    IIRC they are all in the same voice, which suggests it's the TC talking (even to himself). On the other hand, the fact that 'the voice' will sometimes indicate a less dangerous target while you're still engaging a more dangerous one, suggests it's any crew member speaking (or not-very-good implementation of the TC role, in 3-man turret crew tanks, anyway)

    The big problem for me with treating them as 'spotreps' from any crew member is that you lose a pre-eminent feature of WW2 tank crew drills - the TC spotting targets and ordering the gunner to engage them. 'Spotreps' might suit T34/76s and the like, where the TC is the gunner, but for western medium tanks I think it works much better if we take the opportunity to render these reports in speech as Fire Oders. The fact that most targets would be spotted by the TC supports this. We can live with the occasional inconsistency, like the AI tank commander coming to life 'assisting' the player when the player is actually in the role. We already have inconsistencies, like the inability of a player tank commander (unless he's also the gunner) to order ammo selection & loading, and the fact that you can issue driver orders while in the gunner role. One more inconsistency won't hurt, and in return we get something like a realistic representation of Fire Orders. I have always treated what we have now as fire orders (even if I might not always obey them!) and it doesn't bother me at all. Having them represented as Fire Orders in Britpak for me is the way to go.

    As for bearings, I think we'll stick for BVP with the bearings being given as the numbers used by the stock game. Compass points sound less 'military' to me, at least for this kind of application, and besides, if the number is spoken you don't need to translate in your head from compass point to bearing, when looking at the compass rose graphic.

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    Re: British Voice Pack - the plan...

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